June 14, 2007
Vermont Out, D.C. In?
The folks in Vermont are apparently not happy with the state of the union, and they're looking to do something drastic about it -- secede. We say let them go.
A report on Fox News last week found that a movement for Vermont's secession from the United States has apparently picked up steam, with the percentage of supporters in the state growing from eight percent in 2006 to 13 percent this year. And as crazy as the idea might seem, some Vermonters -- long known for their quixotic ways -- are convinced it can work. They even have a name picked out should independence become a reality -- the Second Vermont Republic -- and their own flag. And in a way, the loss of Vermont would give the District something of a historic opportunity.
Should Vermont take its 623,000 residents and form an independent country, the District could easily fill the void that would be left behind by the loss of the state's people and their small congressional delegation -- two senators and one representative. And since Old Glory just wouldn't look right with 49 stars, we could also adopt their star and avoid the inevitable lopsided mess that the flag would become with one less star -- or one more. Call it the path of least resistance to full statehood.
We're not saying we want Vermont gone, but we'd understand if they wanted to go.
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See, Fox viewers? If you keep calling it "the People's Republic of Vermont" the natives start taking the concept seriously. Vermont probably wants Takoma Park as a treaty partner.
Not sure how many true Vermonters are left in that state. Most are former New Yorkers looking for a nice place to live or retire.
We've already had the 49-star flag (July 4, 1959-July 4, 1960). 7 offset rows of 7. Looked pretty good.
No No No, Martin.
Vermont is obviously worth keeping. In fact, we should keep it by force of economic occupation if necessary. The above-said New Yorkers have the right idea with their retirement/vacation homes.
But Texas? Texas really hasn't had much to recommend it since The Storm of 1900 took Galveston. And Texas wanted to go, too, right? Why not encourage them? Really, how often can you walk by a muddy ditch before the the word "Riverwalk" elicits contempt? And the real Alamo is smaller than a 3X5 postcard picture of it.
Occupy Vermont. Jettison Texas.
I adore Mark. I agree completely.
Um, Vermont is pretty, but completely useless and full of stupid hippies. Texas is huge and full of stupid people too, but it's a huge amount of land and produces a lot more toward the economy than that patch of land up north. Make the ex New-Yorkers departure from reality into their idealized liberal safe zone complete.
If Vermont wants to go, let them. Really, we have D.C. or even (though a stretch) Puerto Rico to add if the stars if being offset bothers some of us that much.
Are you kidding?
DC voted that crack head as its mayor and now have that I-cry-over-a-pair-of-pants loser as a judge...what makes DC think it can elect someone worthy of serving American interest?
Ha Ha - pretty funny. Some state is so fed up with the direction this country has taken that they want out.
My family is from the Northeast Kingdom of VT. I grew up going to Town Hall meetings and helping my grandmother serve her constituents (she was a State Representative).
What I remember most? When they had a problem, they'd stop by her house, sit at the dining room table and ask 'What are we doing to do about it?' Another funny. A constituency willing to work on solving the problem.
Vermonters were always an independent lot. They say living in small communities cut off by the mountains leaves you free to think for yourself.
Maybe. But haven't we all seceded from this government? We just don't have a flag to wave.
Couldn't agree with you more Wow. There's no way DC could be expected to elect someone of the caliber of William Jefferson, Tom Delay, Duke Cunningham, Mark Foley, Patrick Kennedy, Bob Packwood, Cynthia McKinney, etc.
You do all realize that maple syrup is a $27 billion industry, right? Do we really want to kiss that goodbye?
voteprime: Lots of maple syrup comes from NY State and Canada.
Mark: It is legally possible that Texas has the right to split into 4 or 5 smaller states. I shudder to think about what that would do to the Senate. Luckily, Texans proposing this action argue about boundaries and who get to call their patch "Texas," so it'll never happen.
Yes, it's easy to mock the caricature that is Texas.
But for those of us that have actually been there, we know better.
Yes, much of modern Texas politics is horrible, having been an early proving ground for the Forces of Hate Masquerading as Christian Warriors.
But there are a lot of decent people there.
And Hippie Hollow. Name me one place in DC that comes close.
And Willie Nelson. I'd take Elder Statesman Willie over Elder Statesman Marion Barry any day.
Generally, the whole Austin area is great.
And I gotta say that even though a lot of Houston was ugly, at least you can get a decent meal without attitude or total indifference there, which is more than you can say for most of our fair city.
Mike Licht: VT is the second largest producer of maple syrup to its neighbor to North, Quebec. VT's economy is dependent on maple syrup, microbrews, tourism, and iced cream.
Are you willing to pay to the additional taxes when VT opts out of NAFTA?
Let's face reality. Martin's post noted that only 13% of the Flatlanders actually want to succeed. Not going to happen. Besides the last time a state (a few actually) did that we fought a civil war. I guess my question is: how tough is the VT guard?
Hillman - I'm almost never served up any attitude when I go out to eat here, where are you going that your servers are such dicks all the time?
Catamount-
I don't like pancakes, prefer Shiner to Magic Hat, vacation where it's warm, and prefer Blue Bell to Ben and Jerrys.
I say let them leave.
Who besides Montgomery Burns calls it "iced" cream?
I've been looking at this for the past six months. In additional to Second Vermont Republic's continued close connection to white supremacist groups like the League of the South, there has been repeated reference to a poll that Vermonters aren't buying any longer.
Questionable methods were used, such questions designed to illicate "response bias." The 8% vs 13% "claim" by SVR (there is no published result from UVM's Center for Rural Studies) falls within the margins for error in both polls, so there may be no increase or even a decline in the support manufactured by the types of questions used.
If you'd like to see the questions and learn more about the purported poll, visit my blog posts - vermontsecession(dot)blogspot(dot)com/2007/03/second-vermont-republic-hid-polling(dot)html, vermontsecession(dot)blogspot(dot)com/2007/03/questions-about-uvm-2006-vermonter-poll(dot)html and vermontsecession(dot)blogspot(dot)com/2007/06/good-news-bad-news-and-no-news(dot)html
I wouldn't say they are dicks all the time. More that they are just indifferent, poorly trained, or both.
I live on the Hill, so my of my complaints are about my own area. Hawk and Dove, Bread and Chocolate, Tunnicliffs, Sonoma, Union Pub, - all frequently have indifferent at best service.
Delivery on the Hill is even worse. Food often arrives cold, is just flat wrong about one fourth of the time, and frequently has stuff missing. And neither the driver nor the take out joint ever seem to care much. One exception - Schezhuan House. It's like they are waiting next door for me to place my order - very fast, very hot, always what I ordered.
Off the Hill, service at Logan Tavern is routinely bad. And The Diner is hit and miss. Quite a few of the joints on U Street have an odd mix of surliness and indifference.
I think it's just a different level of expectation in DC. Service usually isn't so bad that you feel you must complain. It's just that it's indifferent. True, you usually get your food, it's just that quite often it's lukewarm, you have to beg for drink refills, etc.
There are exceptions of course. Old Ebbitt, for instance, has great service. Yes, I know, the hipsters among us cringe at the very mention of anything that's not uber cool. But at Ebbitt they actually train their kitchen and wait staff, and they do a great job.
Hillman: I've relatives out of Texas. One even died at *The Alamo*. The key point of pride for me, however, is that one way or another, most got out of Texas.
Fact is, anything honest that Texas does well is done better somewhere else. Case in point: Texas GSP? How would that have looked without Enron et al ripping off California? Hell, even tall tales are done better in other places. It's just that, in Texas, there's fewer people to check and verify them. Furthermore, I was critiquing Texas' "strengths" by mentioning the Alamo and the Riverwalk (San Antonio). Obviously, talking about Dallas or Houston would be hitting below the belt.
Mark: You raise some valid points. But let's look at your San Antonio example. Sure, their River Walk is basically a muddy bayou. But let's look at DC's Riverwalk. Oh, yeah, for decades it's been mostly concrete plants, drug deals, and grossly underused parcels. And the Georgetown portion? Very poor use of the actual waterfront, and just a few restaurants.
Have you actually spent any time in Houston? I have. It has a lot of things that DC doesn't. Sure, it's the King of Sprawl. But it has a lot going for it that DC doesn't.
And, again, there is Austin and the Hill Country. Things DC will never have. Not just because DC doesn't have the land. It's because by and large our government employees and local businesses are often incapable of anything beyond mediocrity.
As for Enron tainting all of Texas, I have just two words: Marion Barry.
Hillman:
Why would you think it proper to compare DC's "Riverwalk" (whatever it is, it's not what people in the DC Metro Area bragg about) with that in San Antonio (which is one of two things the entire region has to bragg about)?
Also, Austin's great. No doubt. But Austin has the huge misfortune of being surrounded by Texas. The *city* of Austin is actually great in pretty much the same way *state* of Vermont is. Both are quaint, historic, and independent. People actually want to move to both, yet both still have relatively low population pressures.
And comparing Barry with Enron? How is that even realistic? It's not like any scam that Barry pulled caused the economy of another state, say New York, to fail, or was responsible for that state's governor being thrown out and replaced by some aging movie star. Come to think of it, I don't even think he's ripped off any old ladies from Peoria. He's purely a local/micro-regional affliction.
Houston...Dallas... You should just leave those out of the discussion. If I haven't spent much time in either, it's not because I haven't been to them, it's because I saw no reason to stay.
I lived in Houston, so perhaps I know a bit more about it.
Comparing Barry to Enron...... you blamed all of Texas for Enron, when in reality the mess was because of about five douchebags.
And, yes, Barry ruined an entire city. That's on par with what Enron did.
You mentioned San Antonio's Riverwalk disparagingly. I was simply comparing what San Antonio did with an admittedly sad muddy river with what DC has done with a lot nicer river. Which is to say, San Antonio made something reasonably nice out of a muddy slog. DC took two beautiful rivers and, aside from what the Feds did independently of DC, did damn little with it. Much less than San Antonio did.
And you dissed all of Texas, which includes Austin. You didn't differentiate. That's a bit like saying that the good parts of DC don't count, that we should only count the suckass parts.
"I lived in Houston, so perhaps I know a bit more about it."
Perhaps. But you left, right?
Oh, come on. Lighten up. I promise to tone down the Texas trashing after the next elections. You might say, I'll mess less with Texas.
'Till then, it's good clean fun so far as I'm concerned. Hell, I even spent 7 hours cooking brisket just last weekend. It was almost as good as NC bbq. ;)
I left because my partner got a job up here. If he hadn't, I don't think we would have left.
Believe it or not, this is me being light hearted. Sad, isn't it?
Money ain't love, and DC's not everyone's cup of sweet tea. I imagine your apartments would buy a nice investment in a place you loved.
I never said I didn't like DC. It's just that I'm not blind to it's faults and I'm not blind to the merits of other areas.
There would be such a brain flight to VT from NYC and Boston it wouldn't be funny. They'd take off and become an east coast California - an economic and socially progressive engine.